Making Board Members Efficient

00:00:00 Speaker: It's time for AMG's Community Leader Series Podcast Edition. Over the last three decades, AMG has worked to make the role of community leaders more effective and less of a headache. Podcast topics are a response to what our executive board members have requested.

00:00:18 Paul K. Mengert:

Hello everyone. This is AMG Community Leaders Series. Our topic for this episode is making board meetings efficient, and I'm very pleased to have our Director of Operations for AMG Charlotte, Danielle Rudisill, also with us as a special guest today. Danielle, welcome.

00:00:37 Danielle Rudisill:

Thank you for having me.

00:00:38 Paul K. Mengert:

It was really a pleasure. Now, Danielle, I understand and remember that you started in this business as a mere child. So, when I say you've been doing this for 15 years, people are going to have to keep guessing on your age because you started very young. I'm very proud that Danielle has achieved the CMCA designation and brings more than 15 years of experience in North and South Carolina Community Association experience to the table today. She has particular expertise with negotiations and communications and helping boards achieve effective results. So, Danielle, what do you find most satisfying about the association management business?

00:01:24 Danielle Rudisill:

Well, I love getting to work with different groups of people and the unique challenges that different boards bring. And I really enjoy getting to work with groups that are made up of different types of people and trying to find those creative, customized solutions.

00:01:40 Paul K. Mengert:

Those who have listened to a number of our podcasts and know that I often talk about balancing of rights and of course the meetings and the board meetings are often kind of working out a balancing of what different people want. So, I want to jump right into that because we want to leave our community leaders with a couple specific techniques that may help make their meetings more efficient. And one of the things what I think of Danielle, I kind of think of consent agendas because I know she's really helped a number of associations use these effectively. Danielle, tell our listeners what the heck is a consent agenda and how could it be helped?

00:02:22 Danielle Rudisill:

Well, consent agendas are basically where the agenda for the meeting is outlined in advance, and they're designed with the idea that the board members and the vendors and the meeting participants and specifically committee members submit status update reports to the property manager prior to the meeting. This the manager includes and distribute them in the board package in advance so that when the board meeting takes place, everyone's already had an opportunity to review the information and then the board can vote to approve multiple reports at one time rather than discussing and voting on each individual report when they don't have any real questions, then there's no action required.

00:03:08 Paul K. Mengert:

Yeah, and you know, everyone's a volunteer, so nobody wants to sit around the table and kind of waste their time hearing everybody say, oh, yes, I agree. And how frustrating could it be to have everybody to have a lot of people spend a lot of time talking about how they already agree, if everyone agrees. Let's just move on to the next item, right?

00:03:30 Danielle Rudisill:

Absolutely.

00:03:31 Paul K. Mengert:

So, this is certainly not designed to stifle discussion, but designed to give you more time to have the things you really need to discuss and the ministerial approvals. You can get those out of the way.

00:03:46 Danielle Rudisill:

Right. I find that the board members really appreciate this method because it's a better use of their time. Like you said, they're volunteers and I can't tell you how many board meetings I've stayed in where they don't utilize this tool and then they find themselves rushing through the end of the meeting because it's starting to get late, when that's likely when the majority of the discussion really needs to happen because they've saved their votes for, you know, unfinished and new business. But they spent a whole lot of time talking about something that they could have read in advance and that they all agree on.

00:04:24 Paul K. Mengert:

Yeah, I think the clients that have used this technique really feel like they benefit from it because it gives them more time to do what they need to do.

00:04:33 Danielle Rudisill:

I think the other thing that board members really appreciate is that it does give them the time to discuss the things they need to, but ultimately it creates shorter meetings and that allows for a wider group of people being willing to participate. Board members don't want to join this volunteer group when they're there until midnight.

00:04:53 Paul K. Mengert:

Right, right, right. I've yet to meet a director that wants longer board meetings. Well, Danielle, we're going to go to our community Leaders series News Break, and we'll be right back to discuss a couple more aspects of making meetings more efficient.

00:05:09 Speaker:

And now it's time for an AMG Community Leaders Series newsbreak.

00:05:13 Newsbreak:

A condo board in New York City had four out of their seven board positions open in their 2021 election. The election process was administered by a third-party vendor where owners were able to vote in person by proxy, by directed proxy or by online ballot. When the results were sent out, the board president recognized that there was something wrong and realized she'd never turned in the 65 undirected proxies she had tendered. Looking to stay away from controversy, the board sent notices out on their decision to hold a new election. However, some owners took the matter to court because they believed those who are originally announced as winners rightfully earned those positions. The court sided in favor of the owners and a new election was prohibited. Let us know your position on board re-election by leaving us a comment at HOAcommunityleaders.com.

00:05:59 Paul K Mengert:

Boy, Danielle, what a mess that sounds like and I can certainly see both sides. Wow.

00:06:05 Danielle Rudisill:

Yeah, that would be a difficult situation.

00:06:10 Paul K. Mengert:

Well, ladies and gentlemen, I'm pleased to be back with you. My name is Paul K Mengert and I have the honor and privilege of being with Danielle Rudisill today, discussing how to have more efficient board meetings. And we've already talked about one important technique, and we're going to jump right in and talk about what happens in the case of a tie on the board vote. What the heck can they do about that? Doesn't sound as bad as the proxy problem, but it sure does sound like a problem. What can they do about this?

00:06:40 Danielle Rudisill:

Well, this is interesting because this question comes up a lot. Typically speaking, in order for a motion to pass, you need to have the approval or a sense of the majority of the board. So, if a board member makes a motion and the vote is tied effectively, the motion fails.

00:06:57 Paul K. Mengert:

I hear this come up sometime. There's still a lot of confusion about it. Does the president vote at a board meeting?

00:07:04 Danielle Rudisill:

They do. They are a voting member.

00:07:06 Paul K. Mengert:

And I believe that's pursuant to the special rules within Robert's Rules of Order that provides kind of a different set of rules for small groups and assemblies. You're nodding your head, tell them a little bit more about that.

00:07:20 Danielle Rudisill:

Well, the board president is a voting member. Robert's Rules of Order allows for a separate kind of amended set of rules for groups, I believe, of less than 12. So, board members often think that the president only votes in the case of a tie. Or maybe they don't vote at all. But for community associations, specifically, the ones we most often work with, the board president is a participating voting member.

00:07:45 Paul K. Mengert:

Yeah, and I think if you think about it, the Robert's Rules is a concept of making meetings fair and equitable. And when you only have a board of sometimes three people, it wouldn't make sense to have one of them not able to vote. A lot of times boards are five, seven, nine, but some association board are only three, so the president should be a full participant. One of the other things I know is unique about these smaller meetings, it does not require a motion to be seconded. And I think what comes from that is if you only have five people, you don't really need to have two in favor of it to just discuss it. So there's nothing wrong with seconding a motion in a small group, but it's not required. What is required is that you continue to operate in a manner that's fair and equitable and that everybody gets a fair shake. But back to this tie. So, you got a tie. The president voted. It's 3 to 3. We do have some boards with six. Now, what do you do?

00:08:40 Danielle Rudisill:

Well, in essence, the motion has failed. So, board members have the opportunity to make another motion, amending it in some way to kind of sway one person's opinion or another to their side. And then they can try to do that motion in a different way. Again.

00:08:58 Paul K. Mengert:

The great need for compromise.

00:09:00 Danielle Rudisill:

Right.

00:09:02 Paul K. Mengert:

Well, Danielle, hold further thoughts on this. We're going to go to another news break, and we'll be right back in a minute.

00:09:09 Speaker:

It's time for another AMG Community Leader series Newsbreak.

00:09:12 Newsbreak:

A couple in Clinton, Maryland, recently signed a contract with the bank to buy a new home. When the wife reportedly drove by the property and saw a U-Haul in the driveway with people moving in, the couple called the cops after the two men moving into their new home refused to leave. The men showed the cops paperwork which resembled a lease for the property. The cops reviewed the lease and deemed it inaccurate but claimed at this point it looked more like a civil matter between the two parties. To read the full story, visit HOAcommunityleaders.com.

00:09:40 Paul K. Mengert:

Welcome back, folks. I'm Paul K. Mengert here today with Danielle Rudisill the AMG director of operations for Charlotte, discussing how we can make board meetings more efficient and more effective. Danielle, I know we've been hearing a lot about virtual meetings and North Carolina actually passed the law allowing virtual membership meetings, virtual board meetings, I believe have always been authorized, unless there's something prohibiting it in the documents in South Carolina, you may have to check with your lawyer, but often is permitted in South Carolina also. But Danielle, talk about how this has benefited clients. So why is this a good thing for the board members and the community leaders and community members for that?

00:10:24 Danielle Rudisill:

Quite a number of boards utilize virtual meetings now. I think one of the best parts is that it allows for the board members to attend from anywhere. Board members or volunteers. So, they often have full time jobs. They're required to travel. So, there are significantly more options for meeting times when the meeting doesn't require their physical attendance at a specific location. It also allows for improved logistics, especially for my teams. I can't tell you how many times as a manager I would have to bring extra copies of the board package to the board meeting in case one of the board members forgot theirs, which, that happens to us all, but now I can just simply share my screen so that we're all at the same place in the meeting package at the same time. I also think that board members and participants tend to be more focused on the meeting topics, and they don't really use the virtual meetings as like an opportunity for a social gathering, which I find common when people are meeting in person. So, they're all sitting around together. You'll have people having side conversations or discussing things that aren't related to the topic, and I just find that's a lot less common in virtual meetings.

00:11:40 Paul K. Mengert:

Kind of interesting that the Community Association Institute has done some research on virtual meetings and found that roughly 80% of board members prefer virtual meetings and, you know, take it even a step further, about the same percentage of managers and homeowners prefer the virtual meetings. So, it's not unanimous. There are some folks that just don't care for them, but about 80%, according to the national research, does prefer a virtual format. And one of the things I have noticed is that it seems to increase the pool of people available to serve on the board. There are more people, it seems, that are willing to serve if they know the meetings are going to be virtual than people that might have to go up to the church or elementary school or clubhouse or someone's house or the AMG office for a meeting. Them being able to log in virtually. If you work at a job where you have to travel, you don't have to be in town to log into the meetings. Yeah, if you have kids that you have to take care of, you can do that during a virtual meeting. I understand their moms have some superpower, as do some dads, to manage kids and participate in a virtual meeting. I know Danielle's smiling because she's had that task a time or two, but I think these are things that really help associations and is getting them a good result.

00:13:05 Danielle Rudisill:

Well I find as a manager, we often prior to virtual meetings, it would not be uncommon a few times a year between various boards to have a situation where you get to the meeting and then find out you don't have quorum because people can't attend at the last minute. And in a lot of cases, board members travel to this meeting and now they're unable to hold it because they don't have the minimum number of board members present to do that. And I don't think I've had a single instance of that where it's time for the meeting and we don't have quorum, Since virtual meetings were an option. Even if they meet in person, they will allow virtual attendance by some board members if they can't attend with everybody else in a physical setting.

00:13:52 Paul K. Mengert:

Yeah. And of course when you venture into membership meetings, probably a good idea to talk to your attorney about how you're going to conduct membership meeting. But a board meeting is very simple to conduct. People can just vote as a board member and vote in a conference call setting or a Zoom Call setting. When it comes to a membership meeting. And, you know, it's hard to verify who all the people on the line or call may be. There are some other procedures, the simplest often being just sending out a ballot for the actual vote, because as we all know, the actual voting is often just limited to electing a new ward. You know, if there's one thing I know from this industry, there's no one size fits all. There are many different ways to do things and different rules that work for different associations. Well, Danielle, thanks for leading us through some of this discussion. We're going to take our final news break and then come back with an important summary of some of these things. So, you don't want to miss the end of this.

00:14:54 Speaker:

And now our final AMG Community Leaders Series Newsbreak.

00:14:57 Newsbreak:

Residents of a condo association in Myrtle Beach, South Carolina, filed a federal class action lawsuit against their board and the companies that manage the building. The lawsuit claimed that the HOA board members knew for years that the structural steel components supporting the building were steadily deteriorating, yet failed to properly do their part in keeping up with any inspections or repairs needed to prevent this damage. The owners were forced to evacuate in early October after the building was deemed unsafe by the county code enforcement. It was reported the foundation was deteriorating substantially worse than what previous analysis was able to show. To leave a comment or to read the full story, visit HOAcommunityleaders.com.

00:15:37 Paul K. Mengert:

My name is Paul K Mengert and we're back with Daniel Rudisill to discuss some takeaways about how to conduct more effective and efficient board meetings. Danielle, give our listeners a little bit of summation of what you kind of sum all this up.

00:15:57 Danielle Rudisill:

Yeah, well, I think the best way to sum it up is when you make meetings easier for board members, you're going to get increased participation. And you can do that through consent agendas, which allow everyone to review information in advance and cut down on discussions about things everybody already agrees about. And virtual meetings allow for more board member attendance and more flexibility in terms of the time that's required and the location that the person has to be in order to participate. And if you're a board that has a motion with a tie vote, the motion failed.

00:16:35 Paul K. Mengert:

Well, Danielle, this is great. As our listeners know, I usually take the liberty at the end of our discussions to give you Paul's three takeaways, and very similar to what Danielle has said, I would sum this up by saying, number one, don't spend a lot of time talking about what you already agree on. Focus on the things you need to work through. Number two, be mindful of the Robert's Rules of Order that let you use different procedures for small meetings. You still need to vote, but you don't need to. Second, presidents are full participants. When you do come up with a tie or even a close vote, Paul encourages you to try to work through a compromise and get everybody on board. Do you hate to undertake some big project by a 4 to 5 vote and be able to say, Hey, we passed this thing by one vote? I would encourage you in most cases to back up and see if you can't come up with something, you can get to a unanimous vote on, if at all possible. And number three, virtual meetings are really revolutionary to our industry. They're helping more and more people participate. And as you get greater participation, I believe you get greater satisfaction and results in community associations. Well, thank you, everyone, for listening to our episode today. And a special thanks to AMG Director of Operations for Charlotte, Danielle Rudisill. Danielle, I really appreciate you speaking with me and sharing your tips on making board meetings more efficient. I am Paul K. Mengert and this is the AMG Community Leaders Series podcast. To listen to other podcasts or episodes, check out our additional 2022 CLS materials and please go to www, that’s three W's, HOAcommunityleaders.com. Thanks for joining us.

00:18:27 Danielle Rudisill:

Thank you for having me.

00:18:28 Speaker:

Thanks for listening to AMG's Community Leaders Series Podcast Edition. Find more information on this episode online at HOAcommunityleaders.com.

00:18:38 Speaker:

This podcast is for action of BGR Group. Darren Sutherland Executive Director. Jacob's Over the Line. Director. Matt Golden News Director. Chin Rising. Director, Producer. And Jason Controller. Audio Producer. All rights reserved.

• Don’t spend a lot of time talking about what everyone already agrees on.

• Be mindful of Robert’s Rules of Order which lets you use different procedures for smaller meetings.

• Virtual meetings can be a game changer – they can have more people involved, which can lead to greater participation, which can lead to greater satisfaction and results in a community.

Announcing board election results early can be a mistake

A condo Board in New York City had four out of their seven board positions open in their 2021 election. The election process was administered by a third-party vendor where owners were able to vote in person, by proxy, by directed proxy or by online ballot. When the results were sent out, the Board President recognized there was something wrong and realized she never turned in the 65 undirected proxies she had tendered. Looking to stay away from any controversy, the Board sent notices out on their decision to hold a new election. However, some owners took the matter to court because they believed those that were originally announced as the winners, rightfully earned their positions. The court sided in favor of the owners and a new election was prohibited.

Maryland Couple Says Strangers Have Moved into the Home They Just Bought and Refuse to Leave

A couple in Clinton, MD recently signed a contract with a bank to buy a new home, when the wife reportedly drove by the property and saw a U-Haul in the driveway with people moving in. The couple called the cops after the two men moving into their new home were refusing to leave. The men showed the cops, paperwork, which resembled a lease for the property. The cops reviewed the lease and deemed it inaccurate but claimed at this point it looked more like a civil matter between the two parties.

Residents file federal lawsuit against Renaissance Tower HOA

Residents of a condo association in Myrtle Beach, SC filed a federal class-action lawsuit against their Board and the companies that manage the building. The lawsuit claimed that HOA Board members knew for years the structural steel components supporting the building were steadily deteriorating… yet failed to properly do their part in keeping up with any inspections or repairs needed to prevent this damage. The owners were forced to evacuate in early October, after the building was deemed unsafe by the county code enforcement. It was reported the foundation was deteriorating, substantially worse than what previous analysis was able to show.